BMP production chains update

Every time I look at BMP, I am like “the list is insane”. So here is an idea how to fix some issues, with BMP and a few other things.

Lets create a low-tier counterpart to AML (lets call it BML for now, Basic Materials Lab). It could process the lower tier elements, namely MG, S, I and CA. Maybe even CL+NA. Taking a few recipes from SME (S) and CHP (CA, CL+NA) would only do them good.
Such BML could be a t1 building imho, only CL+NA feels like a bit higher tier recipe.
BML might be an awkward starting building, but I would compare it to WEL, they feel quite similar in utilization pattern - niche and overproducing early, but vital later.

PWO might be better suited for CLF. CLF is one of the terribly early overproducing buildings that you only build as a sacrifice and necessary evil when your corp starts technicians. Having PWO would magically make it viable for solo players and it would make a lot of sense thematically too. It would certainly increase price of PWO, but their break-even cost is about 400 each for non-extraction buildings. I have only run napkin maths, but it should be possible to make them cheaper than that even in CLF without any additional changes to the recipe/building. (Could someone better at maths verify?)
SUN is another recipe that could be moved to CLF. Looking at the universe, we can easily start building CLFs already, but I dont think any POPI is popping up quite yet so gating Safety-supporting material behind settlers does not sound too rough. Given current balance, POPI does not seem to be important for Pioneers in general. And uniforms are clothes so they would make sense in CLF.

My last target (for now) is REP. I would move them to FS for the exact same reason I described for CLF - sacrifice, necessary evil, thematics… You get the idea I am sure.

Even after such changes, BMP is still a really versatile building with maybe still too many vital recipes (OVE, MCG and PE will always be needed a lot) so it would not kill the building and the manufacturer start at all.

Opinions? Ideas? :slight_smile:

8 Likes

I like it.
Maybe split the CL+NA recipe in the BML into CL and NA - and leave it as CL+NA in the CHP ?
Efficiency and all.

Well, it’s quite a lot of changes. FS is right now a use one & throw away expense if you want to go REP.

Personally I’d have to redo the plan and possibly some undo as well :slight_smile:

From a balancing point of view, the BMP needing 100 pioneers helps rein in it being so OP. I wonder with this tweaks (which I quite like) if the number should be nudged down a little to reflect the slight drop in pure ubiquity.

2 Likes

FS is needed a lot more later, when you want to make electronics and ships, but yeah, if you only want to make REP, it totally is one of the “run until prefab loss and you are good for the next year” kind of building. If it would make REP itself, as well as the inputs, I think it would be worth keeping it around… maybe :smiley:

well OVE, PE and MCG are three very needed and very different materials, and then there is still PT, EXO, OFF, STR and SEA. Thats a lot of different consumables for both workers and POPI, building materials and an essential basic plastic. And BMP is rather small building, it only takes 12 area so even when it needs a whole HB1, thats just 22 area overall. Still more area-efficient than a lot of other t1 buildings. So even with the above-mentioned nerfs, 100 pioneers would be fine imho.

1 Like

I guess a lot is an overstatement; it’s quite useful if you’re into shipbuilding so it had some use for last 3 months before reset; otherwise you could supply entire uni with maybe single FS until then

This has been discussed from various angles. I can see the logic in splitting the BMP into a materials plant, a clothing plant (Sweat Shop), and an assembly/tools etc. plant. The counterpoint is that it’d make the Manu starting package either have to choose one plant or build all of them. Remember that there is no reason a recipe can’t be in two buildings: I think PE should also be in the POL (Which might make Chemistry a viable starting package, especially with a (basic) materials plant as described above), and the CLF should have the option of making OVE EXO PWO SUN just as the PP2 also has the option of making B-fabs. Whether one building is more or less efficient than another with the same recipe can be used for balancing.
Maybe the BMP needs to be a Basic Workshop, justifying its versatility, but less efficient than a new TEC staffed (Automated?) Production Line building making many of the same things in much larger and longer batches (and also less efficient than a POL for PE, a CLF for PWO…). Certainly Manu needs more TEC.

1 Like

I really want to give a HUGE thumbs up to having:
PE in a POL
OVE (just the COT one), PWO, SUN in CLF
In ADDITION to where they are now. Possibly with a faster build time, but even if not they’d be nice.
Combine this with everything else in Shar’s original proposal but leaving the non-COT OVE recipes in BMP only.

Would be EXCELLENT for both building usage and theme without sacrificing BMP utility
It also creates a chemical starting package thanks to Shar’s basic material lab idea which is just goodness.

1 Like

Should a Chemistry “Basic Materials Plant” be separate from the CHP, or be combined?
Should the Basic Workshop remain the most efficient for PT, STR, OFF and other non-clothing or material items, so that it remains useful even later?

the BML I proposed would totally be a stand-alone building, CHP is pretty overloaded as it is (which is why i proposed taking CA and maybe even CL+NA from it)

PT, STR and OFF are a question. I feel like OVE, PE and MCG are such a strong combination that BMP does not really need much else, but I think PT, STR and OFF are fine to stay there too. There are other buildings that might be worth considering, for example STR miiight be made in PHF instead (it is also not that interesting building atm), but I would not force it.

ha, I did not even realize it when I was “designing” BML, but yes, it would totally be pioneer-tier Chemistry building! And could warrant a new chemistry-focused starting package, yeah, maybe BML+EXT to mine MGS/SCR/CLI/HAL would be a nice starting package, comparable to Metallurgist.

about PE in POL (too), well I did think about that but POL is so crazily utilized now, it only makes a few things, but PG and EPO are the lifeblood of the universe and DEC are also needed for POPI and Ships in significant amounts. I think POL is really important and useful building as it is, Id rather not add more to it.

1 Like

The high need of EPO and PG are why I think it’s not a big deal to add PE to POL. I doubt it would actually be used much. But thematically it makes a ton of sense and I like the idea of some recipes in multiple buildings. I think the way this concept has shaped out overall is very very good.

1 Like

Based on definition, Poly Ethylene of all things should be made in a POLymer plant :slight_smile:

Thanks for the great suggestions! I briefly talked with Counterpoint about the changes and we agreed that we’ll look into simplifying the BMP with the next reset.

1 Like